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Harry Ceramicist's avatar

i don't really undertand this discussion you have been having. But might it be irrelevant, if we accept that all humans are either female or male: because each DSD person, is still actually, overall, clearly in one specific sex category. (BTW, we don't say disabled people are not people- though they have grown or developed differently from the majority of people. Similarly, the existence of DSD people does not invalidate the sex binary.) Just sayin' ... please feel free to ignore this, if it is not helpful...

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Hippiesq's avatar

Part IV (Last part):

I’m less inclined to believe science can give us a good answer for those with non-functional ovotestes, partial feminization and partial masculinization of their body at puberty. They are born with vaginas and, therefore, appear female at birth, although they may appear androgynous as they go through puberty, with some feminine and some masculine characteristics. Such individuals may just not have all the essential characteristics of a male and/or a female or may have all the essential characteristics of both, in which case they simply cannot be characterized as male or female by science. I believe such people have the right to choose what category to use.

I am not seeing the slippery slope created by the bipedal analogy. The existence of some unipedal or nonpedal (or even tripedal) individuals doesn’t change the basic “design” of human bodies, but is just a variation from the normal design, not a new type of human. Similarly, the existence of .02% of the population that doesn’t fit neatly into the male/female sex binary is just a variation from the normal design, not a new type of human (a new sex or several new sexes).

Besides, even if the sex binary wasn't as real as we think, and even if dsds meant that, in addition to the 99.98% of us that easily fit into one or the other category, there are all these other sexes (yet to be named), how would that justify medically altering teenagers' bodies and telling children they are the sex they think they are?

I could go down a rabbit-hole here, and consider that if if .02% of the population may not be male or female, especially if they may appear as if they are one or the other, then perhaps anyone who appears to be male or female may not really be and we are just too unsophisticated to see the variation in these individuals due to limitations of modern science. Perhaps the idea is that my otherwise healthy daughter knows intrinsically that she is not in fact female despite everything we can see and measure. Perhaps, the idea is that these individuals’ brains can identify that they (people like my teenage daughter) are in fact male although they look, sound, smell and feel female by every objectively known test, and that they have disorders of sexual development that aren't apparent because of limitations of science. The argument goes that these invisible dsds are more likely to exist because other dsds exist and some of those people aren't the sex they appear to be.

Similarly, for men who want to enter women's spaces on the premise that they are "really" "women" although they don't appear to be, perhaps the existence of dsds where people might not appear to be the sex they are "supports" their argument because they intrinsically know that the appearance of their bodies, their functional gonads and penises and male-appearing bodies are all wrong, but science just hasn't caught up with their intrinsic knowledge.

Whether .02% of the population having dsds that render it difficult or impossible to categorize them as male or female, or whether this population are really several other sexes, the same argument would be made about the fact that science hasn't caught up with reality. That is, whether there are people who we cannot categorize as male or female or whether they are actually third, fourth...eighty-fifth sex categories we just haven't realized, the argument is that science just hasn't caught up with the categorization of these individuals. This is why dsds are paraded out by trans activists in support of their arguments.

However, there is absolutely no science behind a person having this intrinsic knowledge of their "true sex category." It's unfalsifiable. It relies purely on the say so of an individual about an amorphous, undefined and undefinable feeling of "maleness" or "femaleness." It also relies on a fictional idea of a dsd that would render someone appearing identical to the male or female sex in all measurable ways (yes, perhaps we lack the measurement techniques these people are intrinsically sensing) being the other sex to the extent that they either must have medical alterations so that their body can appear like the sex they say they are and they must be treated as that sex, or (for many of the space-invading men) it just requires them to be treated as that other sex. What odd dsds indeed! I'm not really seeing how the existence of many sexes in that .02% of people with dsds, versus just not being clearly male or female, supports the existence of this bizarre, unfalsifiable dsd.

I'm also not seeing how the analogy to bipedalness supports these bizarre dsds. It’s simply a way of saying that anomalies don’t disprove basic design. I don’t think it sends us anywhere.

If I’ve lost the point of your essay, I apologize, but I think I”ve addressed your main points.

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